Late Great Chevys... In The Great White North (Part 2)

as published in the Chevy Times August 2000 Issue

By Aubrey N. Bruneau

Hanna, Alberta, Canada

Hmm I'd better make this good! Well, What do you think? You haven't turned the page yet... that's positive! It's me again, with the second part of Late Great Chevys in the Great White North.

I've chosen to have the information I hope to convey in this story, represented, for the most part, by this 1964 Pontiac Parisienne Custom Sport convertible. A car that had been extremely poorly repainted orange, three times between 1965 and1980. It was then partially disassembled and stored indoors until 1993. That's how I bought it with the odometer showing 148,000 miles. I reassembled the car with a race prepared 425 hp 409 and drove it for one year. It was stolen and stripped of its running gear on April 10, 1994. A week later I found the car in a parking lot in Edmonton, Alberta, two miles from where it was taken. I kept the car until I couldn't deal with it anymore and elected to sell it in March 1996. Well, enough of that ugliness.

I only received three phone calls on the ad I had placed in the Canadian Old Car Trader, but one was Bing, from Vancouver Island (about 700 miles away). He came out with a friend to make a deal. He subsequently paid me a very fair price for the car and then allowed me to do the #2 driver restoration that you see in these pictures, approximately 600 hours.

There were some 2,985 Custom Sport Convertibles (5,766 Hardtops made in 1964, but only about 20 were near like this one. The factory options include the following: (you'll see they're 1964 Chevrolet).

In addition to the above items, Stampede Pontiac (the selling dealer) in Calgary, Alberta installed the following, prior to sale in March 1964:

Apparently a very common addition by dealerships.

Rather than rambling on with a lot of dry text, I think the accompanying photos will show just how really "Chevrolet" our Canadian Pontiacs are. The similarities that are depicted in this 1964 Pontiac are basically consistent in all 1955 to 1970 Canadian Pontiacs. The Pontiacs and how they directly correspond to Chevrolet models are as follows:

1961 to '64 Strato Chief

1961-'64 Biscayne

1961 to '64 Laurentian

1961-'64 BelAir

However the '62 Laurentian sport coupe does not use the "bubble top" rootlike ourfine Chevolet!

1961 to '64 Parisienne

1961-'64 Impala

The '62 and '63 two-door and Convertibles were available ith bucket seatfloor shift but not any additional model identification.

1964 Parisienne custom Sport 1964 Impala SS

The Parisienne and custom sport models are the most popular. To help one get a "feel" for what these cars really are, we can sum it up as follows: Picture the Catalina/Bonneville trim level including dash board and exterior moldings built on a complete Chevrolet chassis and powertrain. The rest was Chevrolet, floor, trunk, steering, console, and numerous other items. It's like a Grand Prix using the proper "Sport Coupe" roof, that's also available in a Convertible, with an Impala SS attitude! Nice, eh!

Hey, I just realized something! I must be creating quite an impression, 409s, 300hp 327s, 4-speeds everywhere! Well, before my friends in the US rush up here to buy that elusive factory hot rod, I'd better relay some calculated statistics. Now, unfortunately GM of Canada didn't preserve the records very well until 1964. In addition, in order to obtain, "how many of these were-built," one must provide a serial number and $40 for each request. The cost could be staggering, and you must have the car first.

For over twenty years I have owned, driven, repaired, and/or restored nothing but 1961 to 1964 Chevrolets and Canadian Pontiacs (except for a few flat-head Ford coupes. Sorry, I can't help it!) My wife's daily driver is a red 1962 Biscayne wagon, 340hp 409 four-speed! I studied them, and made notes and observations such as assembly line firewall markings, chassis part inspection paint, what is and what isn't painted, identification on the heads of fasteners and how they changed in finish through the years, to name a few. To get to the point, I have made the following calculations from analyzing more of these cars than I care to admit!

In my observations:

1961-1962 Biscaynes, BelAirs, Strato Chiefs, and Laurentians.

More than 50% are 6-cylinders, and I have never seen one with an original 327 or 348. (By the way, Pontiacs used the 261 instead of the 235).

1961-1962 Impalas and Parisiennes, still at least 20% are 6-cylinder and I can count how many 327 and 348s I have seen on one hand.

1963-1964 Biscaynes, BelAirs, Strato Chiefs are still about 30% 6-cylinders. The Laurentian seems to have fared a little better. I just acquired the only 327/250hp Laurentian I've ever heard of 1963-1964 Impalas and Parisiennes, the vast majority are 283s, 327s are less than IO% of production with less than I in 15 being the 300hp (L74) variety. Actually 300hp is almost as rare as a 409. I'd have to estimate total Canadian 409 car production at less than 600.

I'm sure the fact that 409 car production was so low had a lot to do with the cost. Engines and other options not typically built in Canada that had to be shipped across the border were about 50% more costly. An example that I can quote would be as follows:

It also would appear that L80 (425hp) was not available as a factory RPO, but rather a dual carburetor option, installed on the L3 1, by the dealer. I think a lot more of this went on than there are records for. At least that would explain why there seems to be three times as many dual carb manifolds around. This means my "pink wagon" would have sold for nearly $5,300 when it was new. You'll notice that some items are actually less expensive. Our dollar was actually worth something, once!

Chevrolet and Pontiac sold in about the same numbers, with an average of 80,000 units per year total for either line. But, the fact is that Canada's most popular provinces used so much road salt that the cars were virtually destroyed within five years. This explains why it seems that our Canadian members don't have Canadian cars. Well, then come to the prairies!

What are Canadian Pontiacs worth? That is certainly debatable. The "number 2" restoration I performed on this 1964 Parisienne Custom Sport Convertible including purchase price exchanged for $22,000 in 1996. I have turned down $6,000 Canadian for the rusted-out pink wagon with no running gear. On the other hand, I have a 1964 Parisienne two-door Hardtop, 283 glide, in number #5 condition that you can drive home, that I can" get $600 for. (I'm using the "Old Cars Price Guide" definition of condition).

One area which I must question with the "add % for option" method, is Power. Power is (at least seems to be!) everything! I have been involved in, and verified transactions where number 4 and 5 factory 4-speed cars have sold for five times the amount of an equivalent automatic car, not 10% more! But $6,000 for a $400 car because it had L31 on the build sheet? And I still wouldn't sell it. I don't think this genuinely reflects their value.

I think, reasonably, one can conclude that the value of a Canadian 1958-1964 Pontiac is about midway between a similarly equipped Chevrolet and a US Pontiac in the same body style. Well, there it is. After 22 years, I've been able to plead my case, that a Canadian Pontiac is really much better than a Pontiac it's a Chevrolet! And I got to plead it to the most discerning, focused Chevrolet enthusiasts in the world! Yeah, subtlety has been known to elude me now and then!

If you've managed to drag yourself through this story, thanks for your understanding. You'll be relieved to know it shouldn't happen again!

Just one more piece of trivia to pass on to the Late Great members in the US, I'm sure Canadian readers will concur. Most 1958-1964 Chevrolet enthusiasts in Canada are also (albeit sometimes "closet"!) Pontiac enthusiasts. That is, there will be certain years and/or models that we prefer in the Pontiacs. When one considers that the "Heartbeats" (the finest "real world" affordable V8 engines ever made) are common to both cars, I think there's an advantage in the variety of models we have to choose from.

Additional Pics from Part 11

Late Great Chevys... In The Great White North Part 1

THE CANADIAN PONTIAC CLUB

and be sure to check out the 1964 Pontiac site

E MAIL Canadian Pontiac guy... or go to main page just click: http://www.bruneauperformance.ca

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